tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post1899332413880379619..comments2024-03-29T04:00:27.058-07:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: The ScythianDavidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger142125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-86894746162745756702015-12-20T13:44:57.326-08:002015-12-20T13:44:57.326-08:00"A striking number of states nucleated in the...<b><i>"A striking number of states nucleated in the northwest of China in specific area, the Wei river valley and surrounds"</i></b><br />Indeed. A fertile floodplain surrounded by mountains, with high potential to developing trade hubs between farmers and mountain pastoralists. Densely populated at least from 1000 BC (Western Zhou dynasty) onwards, no steppe nearby (Xi'an - FrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-44209123581472651002015-12-20T13:26:38.525-08:002015-12-20T13:26:38.525-08:00@Matt,ryu:
A solid analysis based on "hard fa...<b>@Matt,ryu:</b><br />A solid analysis based on <i>"hard facts"</i> should start with the economic basics. ENF agriculture allowed for a <b>settlement size</b> of 50-100 people. MN innovation (dairying, ard/plough) pushed the limit up to 500 people. Temporarily, up to 1200 people could be supported if all agricultural land was used simultaneously, but this wouldn't have been FrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-9519427470109414642015-12-20T10:44:34.272-08:002015-12-20T10:44:34.272-08:00@Seinundzeit
What you describe sound very simila...@Seinundzeit <br /><br />What you describe sound very similar to caste system, at least the one in Haryana. I guess hamsaya are low caste or not considered part of pathans despite speaking pashto. This is exactly what caste system is like. Pathans not giving away women but have no problem taking them from others. Again 100% similar to caste system in India/haryana where high caste behave in Haryana Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07724711708580494483noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-80514869555720546622015-12-20T05:44:34.432-08:002015-12-20T05:44:34.432-08:00They are different. I re-ran them. Anatolia_Neolit...They are different. I re-ran them. Anatolia_Neolithic1 is the 5 samples that have over 95% coverage.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13876988480444711159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-76521159486588070902015-12-20T02:07:10.429-08:002015-12-20T02:07:10.429-08:00Chad Rohlfsen,
Thank you for providing these stat...Chad Rohlfsen,<br /><br />Thank you for providing these statistics. Could you comment on the following differences?<br /><br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Kalash Primate_Gorilla -0.0177 -5.093 21934 22725 453539 <br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Georgian Primate_Gorilla -0.0051 -1.499 22415 22643 453539 <br /><br />and<br /><br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic1 Kotias Kalash Balajihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09561110603904765636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-82725000761346055112015-12-19T07:35:45.597-08:002015-12-19T07:35:45.597-08:00@RK:
You can compare the political organisation of...@RK:<br /><i>You can compare the political organisation of Russia to Poland-Lithuania. The court of Russia centralised very early, and an appointed bureaucracy in the form of the 'dvoryans' and boyars appeared very early as well, never had an equivalent in India, for example, and something like that developed much later in the rest of Europe, which were still having Fronde as late as Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-34569821507765423262015-12-18T21:29:47.298-08:002015-12-18T21:29:47.298-08:00My list doesn't have all of the pops requested...My list doesn't have all of the pops requested, but here is what I have...<br /><br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic1 Kotias Loschbour Dai 0.0319 6.187 20463 19199 432080 <br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic1 Kotias Karelia_HG1 Dai 0.0068 1.321 21847 21550 475882 <br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic1 Kotias Loschbour Primate_Gorilla 0.0272 5.112 Chadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10118937611048574688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-72609830994255470882015-12-18T17:22:12.971-08:002015-12-18T17:22:12.971-08:00RK,
I'm sorry for taking so long to respond. ...RK,<br /><br />I'm sorry for taking so long to respond. I was finally able to read the stuff you linked and mentioned. Anyway, exceedingly interesting material, thanks!Seinundzeithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14194936397714207913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-21381070196395995752015-12-18T14:51:55.165-08:002015-12-18T14:51:55.165-08:00@ryu:
1. "Church itself was debating internal...@ryu:<br />1. <i>"Church itself was debating internally between the 'Germanic' way of reckoning kinship vs its original method"</i>. "Romanized" Germanics, i.e. Goths, Lombards, Francs etc. had no problem to a/o adapt the Roman count. The Church debate started only when power had shifted to non-Romanized Germanic territory, i.e. East Franks/HRE, by the late 9th centuryFrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-25585409463304756292015-12-18T04:23:51.763-08:002015-12-18T04:23:51.763-08:00The formal statistics you're talking about don...The formal statistics you're talking about don't prove that the Kalash don't have any of this type of ancestry. I'd interpret them to mean that the Kalash have a lower level of it than Georgians, but I wouldn't go further than that.<br /><br />IBS stats don't really help to settle the issue, although they suggest that the Kalash have a fairly normal affinity to the Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-42100594461751848872015-12-18T03:02:29.379-08:002015-12-18T03:02:29.379-08:00@Davidski
"Unlikely, considering the high af...@Davidski<br /><br /><em>"Unlikely, considering the high affinity between the Kalash and Sintashta, and no chance of ASI in Sintashta.<br /><br />The EEF-related signal does show up in the Kalash in Admixture, it's just usually very low or much lower than among everyone else, except Yamnaya and Afanasievo."</em><br /><br />Well, the "high affinity" between Kalash and Albertohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10924243765876609481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-57908457819067958602015-12-18T01:51:24.801-08:002015-12-18T01:51:24.801-08:00@Alberto
Also as pointed out above by Balaji, whi...@Alberto<br /><br /><i>Also as pointed out above by Balaji, while Georgian share the highest drift with Kotias, they also seem to have a good amount of Anatolia_Neolithic that's probably completely missing in the Kalash.</i><br /><br />Unlikely, considering the high affinity between the Kalash and Sintashta, and no chance of ASI in Sintashta.<br /><br />The EEF-related signal does show up in Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-40407728266414906312015-12-18T01:16:03.584-08:002015-12-18T01:16:03.584-08:00@RK: The imperial nuclei, including the Nandas in ...@RK: <i>The imperial nuclei, including the Nandas in Patna, the Guptas in UP, the Delhi sultanate etc. were always the ones directly facing the incursions from the steppe-originated polities such as Indo-greeks/Kushans.</i><br /><br />I don't know if it makes a lot of sense to think of the Indo-Greeks as a steppe originating polity. Otherwise, OK, also the Vijayanagara Empire in South India Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-5482274373700402442015-12-18T01:11:07.611-08:002015-12-18T01:11:07.611-08:00@Chad
Thank you very much for all those stats. So...@Chad<br /><br />Thank you very much for all those stats. Some pretty interesting ones now combining Kotias and Anatolia_Neolithic that give a better understanding than the first ones using LBK_EN. For example regarding Basal Eurasian in Kotias vs. Anatolia_Neolithic:<br /><br />Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Ust_Ishim Primate_Gorilla 0.0013 0.293 21516 21458 452644<br />Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Dai Albertohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10924243765876609481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-18676845145360510592015-12-17T23:50:03.895-08:002015-12-17T23:50:03.895-08:00@ryu: German medievalists generally regard Goody a...@ryu: German medievalists generally regard Goody as refuted, see linked review of the Ulb paper I posted above condoling him for having “to grapple with overcome theories (Goody, Poly).”<br />http://www.h-net.org/reviews/showpdf.php?id=26032<br /><br />Can't say anything on Lancaster and Whitlock, aside from them not being cited in current German-language research.<br /><br />A general issue FrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-38999507885819498152015-12-17T20:56:16.756-08:002015-12-17T20:56:16.756-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ryukendo Khttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11588546655427153692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-33563383466847682102015-12-17T20:31:57.520-08:002015-12-17T20:31:57.520-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ryukendo Khttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11588546655427153692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-24923384582819492692015-12-17T20:03:40.454-08:002015-12-17T20:03:40.454-08:00Chad Rohlfsen,
Thanks for posting those D stats. ...Chad Rohlfsen,<br /><br />Thanks for posting those D stats. I found the following particularly interesting.<br /><br />Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Kalash Primate_Gorilla -0.0177 -5.093 21934 22725 453539<br /><br />Previously, Davidski had calculated the following.<br /><br />Chimp Kalash Kotias LBK_EN -0.0059 -1.503 303595<br /><br />It appears that by using Anatolia_Neolithic in place of LBK_EN, Balajihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09561110603904765636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19013587252724729912015-12-17T18:36:58.968-08:002015-12-17T18:36:58.968-08:00@ryu:
A. You are bringing up Augustine of Canterb...<b>@ryu:</b> <br /><b>A.</b> You are bringing up <b>Augustine of Canterburys letter to Rome</b> in 601 AD - this seems indeed to be the most widely misunderstood part of the evidence. The letter addresses three kinds of "incest", namely marrying (a) a cousin, (b) the step-mother (forbidden in Roman law) and (c) the deceased brother's wife. (b) and (c) are well evidenced and were FrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-29095357273544626922015-12-17T17:01:14.740-08:002015-12-17T17:01:14.740-08:00Hmm that did not come out right. :)
Strangely en...Hmm that did not come out right. :)<br /><br />Strangely enough the Irish claim to be of Scythian stock. <br /><br />https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%A9nius_Farsaid (Fenius Farsaid if the link does not work)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11000684388615334278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-77269577862386160272015-12-17T16:13:09.735-08:002015-12-17T16:13:09.735-08:00Here are a few stats, in addition to what was aske...Here are a few stats, in addition to what was asked for. <br /><br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Loschbour Dai 0.0320 6.295 20464 19196 431752 <br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Karelia_HG1 Dai 0.0049 0.998 21759 21548 475758 <br />result: Anatolia_Neolithic Kotias Loschbour Primate_Gorilla 0.0220 4.361 20520 19636 405517 <br />Chadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10118937611048574688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-5558744973805083972015-12-17T12:41:00.084-08:002015-12-17T12:41:00.084-08:00@RK:
the most powerful Olmec cities could not con...@RK: <br /><i>the most powerful Olmec cities could not control areas just ~30km away, for example, despite the density and homogeneity in the environment, and most villages retained the 'egalitarian huddle' structure not much different from the first Neolithic sites; there is also the complete absence of a standing military force. Such complete stasis in state size and complexity Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-64643973448640734302015-12-17T07:41:47.938-08:002015-12-17T07:41:47.938-08:00I'll check those Dstats after I get home, arou...I'll check those Dstats after I get home, around 5pm CST.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13876988480444711159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-51418129475942434282015-12-17T07:07:37.510-08:002015-12-17T07:07:37.510-08:00@RK
Thanks for the consanguinity stats. The high ...@RK<br /><br />Thanks for the consanguinity stats. The high consanguinity rates in Turkmens must be because, like Kazakhs, Kyrgyz and Karakalpaks, they do not consider descendants of female relatives related. Onur Dincerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05041378853428912894noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-55723801856465898612015-12-17T04:26:20.435-08:002015-12-17T04:26:20.435-08:00That is not true at all, off memory the Turkmen ar...<i>That is not true at all, off memory the Turkmen are the most endogamous of Afghanistan's ethnic groups by some margin, even more so than Pashtuns.</i><br /><br />No, cousin marriage is a taboo among Turkmens up to several generations as in Kazakhs, Kyrgyz, Karakalpaks and Mongols and unlike Uzbeks, Uyghurs and Tajiks.Onur Dincerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05041378853428912894noreply@blogger.com