tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post2254300565925758777..comments2024-03-18T22:01:02.498-07:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: Watch the red arrows naysayersDavidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger192125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-82347194777674292082018-01-26T16:18:32.112-08:002018-01-26T16:18:32.112-08:00This is what Underhill had to say in his paper (fr...This is what Underhill had to say in his paper (from which the picture at the top was sourced):<br /><br /> Although the R1a1a* frequency and diversity is highest among Indo-Aryan and Dravidian speakers, the subhaplogroup R1a1a7-M458 frequency peaks among Slavic and Finno-Ugric peoples. Although this distinction by geography is not directly informative about the internal divisions of these Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07391102431813745322noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-1383368927616892162018-01-09T02:58:25.330-08:002018-01-09T02:58:25.330-08:00@Shah
"Wait, so there might have been pure E...@Shah<br /><br />"Wait, so there might have been pure Eastern Iranics living in Central Asia until the 1500s?"<br /><br />Yup, I'm sure Turkic admixture did not become a regularity in the Tajik classes well after the Mongol invasions. <br /><br />Again, the reason I think Laz came to a hasty conclusion is because he'd assumed that IAMs' SSA admixture is what pulls them in Anthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-2044887650312557592018-01-03T22:46:27.272-08:002018-01-03T22:46:27.272-08:00@Jijnasu
"While there were very likely ...@Jijnasu <br /><br /> "While there were very likely migration of Indo-Aryans into the subcontinent in the bronze age, one can't help but notice that an element of racism and euro-centrism continues to colour views on the issue. If the facts were all that mattered one would hardly stress on the 'europeanness' of yamnayans (a highly anachronistic and arbitrary term)"<br /><Nathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03927286405195976694noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-85386892004305983222018-01-03T22:12:26.366-08:002018-01-03T22:12:26.366-08:00@Shahanshah of Persia
"Indian Nationalists&q...@Shahanshah of Persia <br />"Indian Nationalists" can be a misleading term. I am Dravdian; these Indians pushing O.I.T / Hindutva revisionism are mostly upper caste Hindus from North India and Brahmins from South India. These upper castes identify as Aryan, so they want to claim IVC is Aryan and Aryans are native. It is no different to White Supremacists claiming Ancient Egypt and SumerNathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03927286405195976694noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-9477207058527138172018-01-01T08:02:04.458-08:002018-01-01T08:02:04.458-08:00Sein: I'd like to hear your opinions concernin...Sein: <i>I'd like to hear your opinions concerning this method.</i><br /><br />Honestly, I feel I have nothing of value to say there. I can't really say I'm certain I have a grasp the fine details of how the method actually differs in operation to the ADMIXTURE. I understand that they are estimating a space, then estimating ancestors and proportions from the limits of that space, and Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-88944627228762486282018-01-01T08:01:45.777-08:002018-01-01T08:01:45.777-08:00Sein: True, I think it did show 18%; but for what ...Sein: <i>True, I think it did show 18%; but for what it's worth, only in the joint-fitting topologies. When only including the Kalash, he found 10% ASI.</i><br /><br />Good point. Potentially though for non-cofitting models, I do think qpGraph can "slide around" a bit under these models and end up with ancestor populations with similar positions in nodes but which are a bit Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-43997727542689863252017-12-31T21:39:08.634-08:002017-12-31T21:39:08.634-08:00Matt,
Oh, before I go to wreck havoc on the stree...Matt,<br /><br />Oh, before I go to wreck havoc on the streets (lol), I should mention this:<br /><br />https://www.biorxiv.org/content/early/2017/12/29/240812<br /><br />I'd like to hear your opinions concerning this method.<br /><br />(We'll talk after New Year's day; or, at the very least, before the end of January)Seinundzeithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14194936397714207913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-69831151508816143592017-12-31T21:27:47.450-08:002017-12-31T21:27:47.450-08:00Continuing from where we left off...
But even aft...Continuing from where we left off...<br /><br />But even after factoring all of this into our general picture, the whole model of West Eurasian vs ASI is probably not quite effective at describing reality as it truly is, since Iran_N/CHG and ANE/EHG already had substantial ENA ancestry (prior to their entrance into the Central/South Asian scene).<br /><br />In fact, even WHG and Anatolia_N seem Seinundzeithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14194936397714207913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-42151449201985455612017-12-31T21:14:31.333-08:002017-12-31T21:14:31.333-08:00Matt,
"The K11 S Asian component actually do...Matt,<br /><br />"The K11 S Asian component actually doesn't look too Iran_N like to me."<br /><br />Considering that we're referring to an ADMIXTURE component, we must admit that, at a certain point, one becomes entangled in the fallacy of misplaced concreteness.<br /><br />"Distribution of K11 S Asian also does not peak so much with what we'd expect Iran_N to but in Seinundzeithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14194936397714207913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-74733995478754143352017-12-31T10:17:19.258-08:002017-12-31T10:17:19.258-08:00@Sein, banging on again here a bit, but btw, re: &...@Sein, banging on again here a bit, but btw, re: "Zack's earlier K11, with a Iran_N-like West Eurasian component and a "Onge" component, only showed 11% ASI for Pakistani Pashtuns, 7% for the Balochi, and 5% for the Brahui", I had a quick look at this using the reference data and Fst data from here: http://www.harappadna.org/2011/04/reference-3-admixture-k11/.<br /><br />Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-17557831996972968572017-12-29T18:31:38.027-08:002017-12-29T18:31:38.027-08:00@Anthro Survey
"I speculate that such a scen...@Anthro Survey<br /><br />"I speculate that such a scenario probably held for CeltIberian early Italic(Umbro-Samnite) nobilities. In the former case, we can assume they were NorthernFrench-like, 2D PCA-wise. In the latter case, they packed more steppe ancestry, less Bronze Age Anatolian input and likely sported individuals resembling Ignazio Abate. I'd also say their Anatoalian:EEF ratioAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17783059930095629402noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-33821053013607683282017-12-29T18:26:30.814-08:002017-12-29T18:26:30.814-08:00@Anthro Survey
Sorry for the late reply, I have b...@Anthro Survey<br /><br />Sorry for the late reply, I have been very busy. <br /><br />"That is a reasonable assumption on your part and I, too, believe that early Median and Achamenid nobility had elevated steppe ancestry compared to the general population---perhaps in the neighborhood of 40%."<br /><br />I personally think that it was a bit higher than that, up to 60%, perhaps even asAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17783059930095629402noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-83660585580054903602017-12-29T08:51:57.558-08:002017-12-29T08:51:57.558-08:00@Sein, hmm, I'm not totally confident in the p...@Sein, hmm, I'm not totally confident in the patterns using Onge and Jarawa components in PCA/ADMIXTURE because of the likelihood that these have some different drift going on which makes them less attractive as clusters for either the SA component or real SA populations.<br /> <br />But yeah, actually thinking about it, on your other point, Reich's f4 ratio could be a little off from EHGMatthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-20334548909243269012017-12-28T17:49:01.922-08:002017-12-28T17:49:01.922-08:00@Shah
Regarding SSA---
Once again, I am not deny...@Shah<br /><br />Regarding SSA---<br /><br />Once again, I am not denying the presence of REAL SSA admixture in contemporary North Africa and Near East(mainly in Muslims). It is certainly there as evidenced by formal stat results, but probably does not account for the entirety of the SSA signal. <br /><br />Arabophone Maghrebis likely pack 10% REAL SSA admixture, while the other 10% is owed to Anthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-50314356532843900552017-12-28T17:33:23.125-08:002017-12-28T17:33:23.125-08:00West of the ALTAI, not Ural, I mean.West of the ALTAI, not Ural, I mean.Anthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-83389298151561882822017-12-28T17:32:31.190-08:002017-12-28T17:32:31.190-08:00@Shah
That is a reasonable assumption on your par...@Shah<br /><br />That is a reasonable assumption on your part and I, too, believe that early Median and Achamenid nobility had elevated steppe ancestry compared to the general population---perhaps in the neighborhood of 40%. <br /><br />I speculate that such a scenario probably held for CeltIberian early Italic(Umbro-Samnite) nobilities. In the former case, we can assume they were Anthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-61016100778022562222017-12-27T03:34:05.071-08:002017-12-27T03:34:05.071-08:00"First off, don't assume people's ori..."First off, don't assume people's origins. I have a thing for Haile Selassie's look and like Semitic type names like "Sa'azana" (Ge'ez name) but I'm a Flem from Belgium in actuality = these people are as part of my heritage as Davidski's."<br /><br />I know it's a Ge'ez name, and I also know who Selassie is. In case you did not know, Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17783059930095629402noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-61122017518269809392017-12-27T02:04:14.144-08:002017-12-27T02:04:14.144-08:00@Baba Sa'azana
Everything I wrote earlier is ...@Baba Sa'azana<br /><br /><i>Everything I wrote earlier is not hard to understand.</i><br /><br />It is, because you're not making any sense, to the point that I had to simply ignore all of your ramblings.<br /><br />Just to give you one example: you accept that Europe is a modern-day concept, and yet at the same time you claim that WHG is the only real European population.<br /><br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-9807894755396942502017-12-27T01:46:52.720-08:002017-12-27T01:46:52.720-08:00First off, don't assume people's origins. ...First off, don't assume people's origins. I have a thing for Haile Selassie's look and like Semitic type names like "Sa'azana" (Ge'ez name) but I'm a Flem from Belgium in actuality = these people are as part of my heritage as Davidski's. <br /><br />Now, if you're done cuckolding yourself for Europeans like us who see you as a sand-negro regardless, you Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00088171693237364919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-28937649811276376462017-12-26T16:27:00.286-08:002017-12-26T16:27:00.286-08:00@Baba Sa'azana
Well, the Yamnaya people are c...@Baba Sa'azana<br /><br />Well, the Yamnaya people are closer to Europeans than any other people, and they originated in Europe as well, despite being partially West Asian. Anyway, why don't you focus on your own heritage and your half-African and half-Natufian origins? It's not like the Yamnaya came from Africa, now is it? They were a Caucasoid people, not a Negroid-Caucasoid (Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17783059930095629402noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-41348095629384249992017-12-26T15:24:17.055-08:002017-12-26T15:24:17.055-08:00Amazing rebuttal, you didn't even refute anyth...Amazing rebuttal, you didn't even refute anything I said. But I suppose because their genetic structure would have likely formed in Africa IAM and Keb are "African"? You're just oversimplifying things to suit your needs.<br /><br />Yamnaya-related people are largely the result of intermixing between Eastern-European Hunter-Gatherers (themselves part UP-Siberian) and West-Asians Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00088171693237364919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-52923626676572646432017-12-26T15:06:33.392-08:002017-12-26T15:06:33.392-08:00@Baba Sa'azana
Archaeological cultures like S...@Baba Sa'azana<br /><br />Archaeological cultures like Sredny Stog and Yamnaya formed and were located in Eastern Europe.<br /><br />It's very basic geography. So don't over think this, just look at a decent map...<br /><br /><a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/18q72B7FjzGxRpLAvI0WsoEBsRR92-skS/view?usp=sharing" rel="nofollow">Map of ancient Central and Eastern Europe</a><br /><Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-12589039504774582362017-12-26T14:48:58.826-08:002017-12-26T14:48:58.826-08:00@ Davidski
So it can be described as a European p...@ Davidski<br /><br /><i>So it can be described as a European population. Reasonable people without any agendas should be able to accept this without too much of a problem, no?</i><br /><br />No offense but you're literally the only one here who seems to have an agenda... You're so fixated on them being "European" that you'll use silly arguments like how they share a lot of Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00088171693237364919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-38998266359177824582017-12-25T04:51:12.250-08:002017-12-25T04:51:12.250-08:00Hi.
My Ancestry DNA results came back with a 47...Hi. <br /><br />My Ancestry DNA results came back with a 47% British, 8% Scottish, 6% Scandinavian, 11% West Europe but what is surprising is the 16% Caucasus and 6% South Europe. <br /><br />I have no known descendants from the Caucasus or South Europe. Is this % likely to be modern or ancient DNA ? Is there a way to work it out? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-854504833416207852017-12-23T00:34:54.881-08:002017-12-23T00:34:54.881-08:00@Anthro Survey To get back to your latest reply, I...@Anthro Survey To get back to your latest reply, I definitely agree with you. Though, the SSA in North Africans is not due to a ghost effect. I think it's actual SSA. The reason I say this is because late Neolithic North African samples from Morocco barely showed any SSA at all, whereas modern North Africans have around 20%. There is no way that it could be due to Basal. In regards to other Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17783059930095629402noreply@blogger.com