tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post3563444285286545283..comments2024-03-18T22:01:02.498-07:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: Days of high adventureDavidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger235125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-32629294376191621242016-12-01T11:11:46.288-08:002016-12-01T11:11:46.288-08:00@Matt
Even though this is two weeks late, I want ...@Matt<br /><br />Even though this is two weeks late, I want to say thank you again regarding answering my inquiry about the West Eurasian admix in SE Asians. <br /><br />So it seems despite SE Asians like Burmese, Cambodians, Malays, Thais often show "South Asian" in ADMIXTURE components, there is actually very minor to negligible West Eurasian. It makes me thing now that the "Ramberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18057789585601848229noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-87501765342122259202016-11-24T11:44:46.802-08:002016-11-24T11:44:46.802-08:00@hujbregts:
Interesting that all of the Pops liste...@hujbregts:<br />Interesting that all of the Pops listed by you as clustering with Sintashta - CW_Germ., BB-Germ., Unetice, Hung_BA - are from Central Europe. I had earlier remarked that CW_Poland (misnomed, archeologically it is clearly early Unetice) seems to have quite the admixture required, and chronological placement, to explain the additional CE-like element in Sintashta. Any chance to getFrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-21498668337481103612016-11-24T06:06:54.451-08:002016-11-24T06:06:54.451-08:00@EastPole
In my most recent k=8 model I too notic...@EastPole<br /><br />In my most recent k=8 model I too noticed a relation between Sintashta and Czech.<br />However I prefer a different interpretation. <br />In my model both pops are present in a cluster 2 (Czech=0.897, Sintashta=0.648) <br />I labeled this cluster as a N_European cluster.<br />Several other Bronze Age steppe-like pops are also present in this cluster: <br />Unetice(0.830), huijbregtshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15146303681173955347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-32907441265074422912016-11-24T01:52:29.655-08:002016-11-24T01:52:29.655-08:00" Direct Steppe admixture" is not very r..." Direct Steppe admixture" is not very relevant for the core of the West Iranic speakers. Iron Age and Safavvid era samples actually indicate that "Steppic admixture" was very low from the beginning on. Their ethnogesis appear to have formed via the Yaz culture at the Northeast and Kura Araxes at the Northwest. At least their genetic make up looks like Kura Araxes + something Kurtihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00818803833239507313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-36426986439917828802016-11-23T23:50:27.547-08:002016-11-23T23:50:27.547-08:00@huijbregts
I got similar results to your Dstats_...@huijbregts<br /><br />I got similar results to your Dstats_fuzzy7.csv<br /><br />Analyzing your Dstats_fuzzy7.csv I noticed that Sintashta clusters with Czech.<br />Similar cluster percentages:<br /><br />http://s18.postimg.org/3ron3lv8p/screenshot_97.png<br /><br />Looking at the composition of Sintashta and Czech and at the character of the clusters it seems that Sintashta was shifted towards EastPolehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02385485387444006342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-33325841006418660492016-11-23T08:01:28.864-08:002016-11-23T08:01:28.864-08:00Thanks kurd, Sein,
So retroflexion is not superfi...Thanks kurd, Sein,<br /><br />So retroflexion is not superficial but quite rooted in afghanistan overall.<br /><br />dder is of course ddhEr in hindi/bengali etc meaning much/a lot of/heap/pile<br />if you notice the difference is its a voiced aspirated retroflex as opposed to just a voiced retroflex.<br /><br />The word is one of the many that shows the deep rootedness of both initial postneohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09364121752386612217noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-87014600818834673402016-11-23T04:49:22.591-08:002016-11-23T04:49:22.591-08:00@Ryan,
After reading your post I downloaded and r...@Ryan,<br /><br />After reading your post I downloaded and read the "Accepted Manuscript" version of the paper. It does not say much about K*.<br /><br />"Other haplogroups such as R1a, K*, J2b may derive from extraneous genetic inputs from Central Europe, the Balkans and Southwest Asia."<br /><br />Maybe the supplementary data has more. Or Figure 2 which is unreadable in the Garvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08917487267933584193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-2700189229962713212016-11-23T04:18:17.852-08:002016-11-23T04:18:17.852-08:00Ryan,
In a previous paper by the same authors, th...Ryan,<br /><br />In a previous paper by the same authors, they have examined the Y-DNA of 78 members of Bantu populations in Maputo Province (the southernmost province of Mozambique) and found that most of them belong to the E1b1a1a1-M180 (56/78 = 71.8%) or B2a1a-M109 (11/78 = 14.1%) clades typical of Bantu populations. The other clades observed are as follows:<br /><br />1/78 = 1.3% Ebizurhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16925110639823856429noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-12407856927287826222016-11-23T03:24:29.798-08:002016-11-23T03:24:29.798-08:00@ FrankN
From what I understand, the rise in wate...@ FrankN<br /><br />From what I understand, the rise in water levels was gradual, not catastrophic. In fact, the Khvalynian region appeared to have been locked by Ice during the LGM, meaning contact between western Siberia & eastern Europe could only have occurred more north, <i>through</i> the Urals, and indeed there is some evidence for this. The Caspian transgression might have only Robhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07166839601638241857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-11459790602256704652016-11-23T03:05:06.753-08:002016-11-23T03:05:06.753-08:00@ Dave
"This might be some sort of ancient S...@ Dave<br /><br />"This might be some sort of ancient South Asian-derived ancestry that has been floating around Iran and Central Asia since the Mesolithic.<br /><br />My new test might be able to spot more differences between Iran_Hotu and Iran_Neolithic. We shall see soon."<br /><br />Yes, Iran Neolithic seems to have something like that <br /><br />Iran_Neolithic<br />"Robhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07166839601638241857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-35369483366428579882016-11-23T01:33:50.633-08:002016-11-23T01:33:50.633-08:00Postneo,
In pashto retroflex is not restricted to...Postneo,<br /><br />In pashto retroflex is not restricted to indic borrowings only. Oddly, it applies to English words such as ttelivision or ttelifon, although when applied to the letter t it is not noticeable. <br /><br />It is also used in pashto words, for ex ttang ttakor- Music notes, music party...<br /><br />Ttagi kawal - to defraud (Ttagi also used in Saraiki)....ttokhal- to cough<br /><Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15490428210271408340noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-14896855358443086952016-11-23T00:53:26.582-08:002016-11-23T00:53:26.582-08:00@Dave: "According to the Basal-rich K7, Iran_...<b>@Dave</b>: "<i>According to the Basal-rich K7, Iran_Hotu packs more ANE and more of some other, perhaps Central Asian, stuff that often looks like Andamanese-related admixture.</i>"<br /><br />Your AdmixQ13 tells a slightly different story. It neither shows any Andamese-related stuff for Zagros SubNeolithic, nor for Iran_Hotu. Here is where both differ (Bedouin, Anat_Neol, Andamese FrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-6223211964471657462016-11-23T00:29:13.729-08:002016-11-23T00:29:13.729-08:00huijbregts,
Very nice, thanks for attempting this...huijbregts,<br /><br />Very nice, thanks for attempting this.Seinundzeithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14194936397714207913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-54943830820766557012016-11-23T00:26:34.813-08:002016-11-23T00:26:34.813-08:00postneo,
No problem.
Pashto does have word initi...postneo,<br /><br />No problem.<br /><br />Pashto does have word initial retroflexion. Not sure about Balochi.<br /><br />Also, retroflex consonants aren't restricted to Indic borrowings.<br /><br />Pashto has a surprisingly conservative vocabulary (it is one of the most "archaic" of all contemporary Iranian languages), and words of Indic origin are quite small in number. So, Seinundzeithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14194936397714207913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-88335595488920038362016-11-23T00:12:17.630-08:002016-11-23T00:12:17.630-08:00@Matt, Sein
This is really nice.
I have done a fu...@Matt, Sein<br /><br />This is really nice.<br />I have done a fuzzy cluster analysis on the Dstats.<br />This time I like the fuzzy clusters better than the mclust.<br />CHG is now in a Caucasian cluster as it should be and the Siberian cluster is broken up in East and West.<br /><br />Go to the file Dstats_fuzzy7.csv in https://www.dropbox.com/sh/4njpy307pui1kpq/AACx32eLw9s363IrqhsW4wifa?dl=0<huijbregtshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15146303681173955347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-15816120365870378492016-11-22T23:32:22.122-08:002016-11-22T23:32:22.122-08:00Thanks Sein,
I have many questions but will keep ...Thanks Sein,<br /><br />I have many questions but will keep it simple. Does Pashto or Balochi have word initial retroflexion? Similar to words in hindi like ThanDA (cold), TopI(cap) etc.<br /><br />Is retroflexion restricted to indic borrowings or has it seeped in to grammatical forms and persian lexicon as well ?postneohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09364121752386612217noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-1265709444297468962016-11-22T23:04:25.246-08:002016-11-22T23:04:25.246-08:00@aniasi ".. what exactly was the difference b...<b>@aniasi</b> "<i>.. what exactly was the difference between Iran Neolithic and Iran Hotu?</i><br /><br />Iran Neolithic comes from the Central Zagros eastern foothills. Actually, there have been several Central Zagros samples from different periods/ cultures tested. Dave in his AdmixQ13 refers to I1945 and I1290 as Iran_Neol. Both are from around 8,000 BC or a bit younger, and represent FrankNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01292462554916779884noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-47164742663319418572016-11-22T21:20:02.323-08:002016-11-22T21:20:02.323-08:00Anyone seen the text of this paper btw?
http://ww...Anyone seen the text of this paper btw?<br /><br />http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0378111916305704<br /><br />Apparently wiki says there's some weird unclassified Y-DNA K* in Mozambique in the paper, but even the supplementals are behind a paywall, and I'd like to know which subclades of K the tested for.Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07906194112935320590noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-318043095645592252016-11-22T19:08:02.037-08:002016-11-22T19:08:02.037-08:00According to the Basal-rich K7, Iran_Hotu packs mo...According to the Basal-rich K7, Iran_Hotu packs more ANE and more of some other, perhaps Central Asian, stuff that often looks like Andamanese-related admixture.<br /><br />https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tFAa7oxWpcNN-OdMMjBdb4NeWKG7EkpKMzZJVW2_MME/edit?usp=sharing<br /><br />This might be some sort of ancient South Asian-derived ancestry that has been floating around Iran and Central Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-55641596409673293872016-11-22T18:59:22.522-08:002016-11-22T18:59:22.522-08:00Stupid question, but what exactly was the differen...Stupid question, but what exactly was the difference between Iran Neolithic and Iran Hotu?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-71377323142092196822016-11-22T18:32:24.913-08:002016-11-22T18:32:24.913-08:00Running late with the launch of the new test/fundr...Running late with the launch of the new test/fundraiser. Might need the weekend to get everything together.<br /><br />Btw, there might be a couple of new versions of 4mix coming out soonish. One might be called InfinityMix.Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-91473385730903185242016-11-22T08:58:22.213-08:002016-11-22T08:58:22.213-08:00@Matt, Sein
I found a cluster model of the Dstats:...@Matt, Sein<br />I found a cluster model of the Dstats:<br />Dstats_mod5_EEV7.jpg<br />Dstats_PopByClust.txt<br />https://www.dropbox.com/sh/4njpy307pui1kpq/AACx32eLw9s363IrqhsW4wifa?dl=0<br /><br />The main remaining irritation is that CHG clusters with Levant instead of Caucaus.huijbregtshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15146303681173955347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-36682990368568854622016-11-22T06:34:18.766-08:002016-11-22T06:34:18.766-08:00@EastPole
This if very helpful.
So the left table ...@EastPole<br />This if very helpful.<br />So the left table should be identical to fuzzy8.csv because it is also produced by fclust.<br />I understand the definition in the right table as meaning that it these are the initial values of an iteration process of mclust. Judging from the many 100% values it is pretty useless.<br />Thanks again.huijbregtshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15146303681173955347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-54859431850172339442016-11-22T06:06:18.441-08:002016-11-22T06:06:18.441-08:00@Huijbregts
I didn’t do any fuzzy clustering with ...@Huijbregts<br />I didn’t do any fuzzy clustering with mclust<br />I removed outliers, averaged the data, did PCA and used the 4 relevant dimensions PC1-PC4 for clustering as a data set named CWEtestPCA.<br />First I did mclust to determine the number of clusters:<br /><br />library(mclust)<br />maxclust <-50<br />CWEtestPCAMCLUST <- Mclust(CWEtestPCA[, 2:5], G=1: maxclust)<br />summary(EastPolehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02385485387444006342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-88758543126162268182016-11-22T04:20:54.960-08:002016-11-22T04:20:54.960-08:00@EastPole
This is a nice way to compare the two se...@EastPole<br />This is a nice way to compare the two sets of clustering results.<br />Your mclust results closely match my fclust results in fuzzy8.csv.<br />But your fclust results are different and even implausible. They imply that all the Eastern Europeans are 100% cluster 5 !<br />Something must have gone wrong.<br /><br />I did not know that fuzzy clustering is possible with mclust. After huijbregtshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15146303681173955347noreply@blogger.com