tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post9022699860244015800..comments2024-03-29T04:00:27.058-07:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: Genetic continuity across the millennia in central PolandDavidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger182125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-7527054630517433282019-06-21T14:38:36.124-07:002019-06-21T14:38:36.124-07:00Ancient tuberculosis from Kujawy:
Screening metho...Ancient tuberculosis from Kujawy:<br /><br />Screening methods for detection of ancient Mycobacterium tuberculosis complex fingerprints in next-generation sequencing data derived from skeletal samples <br />Borówka et al. 2019<br /><br />https://academic.oup.com/gigascience/article/8/6/giz065/5521156<br /><br />Arzahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10459843383682766479noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-18497802868670578862019-06-17T17:21:15.232-07:002019-06-17T17:21:15.232-07:00@Zardos
Some of the Poles from Lublin (eastern Po...@Zardos<br /><br />Some of the Poles from Lublin (eastern Poland) in the Human Origins dataset clearly have German and/or Dutch origins.<br /><br />One is basically fully Dutch, and a couple look half German/half Polish.<br /><br />I'm not sure if these samples should be marked as Poles in the Human Origins, and I've raised this issue with Harvard, but whatever.<br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-65526757732362489082019-06-17T08:09:39.223-07:002019-06-17T08:09:39.223-07:00As for Germanic (and other, like Iranian) influenc...As for Germanic (and other, like Iranian) influences in Poles there are very ancient ones likely, but these would have been present in the early Medieval times already and distributed quite evenly, so hard to detect without a reference.<br /><br />As for later Western and especially German colonists, there were a lot which assimilated regionally.<br />Especially if no larger settlements and zardoshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17818491540055232430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-85106154413609014112019-06-16T12:22:07.473-07:002019-06-16T12:22:07.473-07:00@Joe Flood
Before you try and write something abo...@Joe Flood<br /><br />Before you try and write something about R1a, make yourself familiar with the oldest instances of Y-haplogroups P, R and R1a in the ancient DNA record. For instance...<br /><br /><a href="https://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2018/10/y-haplogroup-p1-in-pleistocene-siberia.html" rel="nofollow">Y-haplogroup P1 in Pleistocene Siberia</a><br /><br />And then also make yourself familiarDavidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-30439586189448546142019-06-16T07:31:12.958-07:002019-06-16T07:31:12.958-07:00Davidsky, actually I borrowed from some of your ow...Davidsky, actually I borrowed from some of your own work in creating the earlier part of my R1a draft paper. If you have a critique - I recommend you submit it rather than talking about 'nonsense'. <br /><br />In this case it looks like you've drawn upon a couple of throwaway lines at the end of a forty-five page draft paper that were intended to introduce a sequel and provoke a Joe Floodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14684083205595693107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-18768859250602328382019-06-15T16:36:42.197-07:002019-06-15T16:36:42.197-07:00OT; Having a think again about the Roman and Itali...OT; Having a think again about the Roman and Italian papers and put together a G25 metapca to get a look at things: https://imgur.com/a/0sWwM1E<br /><br />It seems like Italy Bergamo could be found by a combination of Empuries2 (Greek colonist?) and Empuries1 (Gaulish "Celts", presumably). Southern Italians and Mediterranean Jewish populations then look very specifically clinal between Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-6678508345414577382019-06-15T15:44:10.466-07:002019-06-15T15:44:10.466-07:00@Open Genomes
See here...
Polish aDNA PCA
Moder...@Open Genomes<br /><br />See here...<br /><br /><a href="https://polishgenes.blogspot.com/2017/06/polish-adna-pca.html" rel="nofollow">Polish aDNA PCA</a><br /><br /><a href="https://polishgenes.blogspot.com/2018/01/modern-day-poles-vs-bronze-age-peoples.html" rel="nofollow">Modern-day Poles vs Bronze Age peoples of the East Baltic</a><br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-84494227026790109042019-06-15T15:36:19.521-07:002019-06-15T15:36:19.521-07:00@Dragos
“Modern day poles overwhelmingly descend ...@Dragos <br />“Modern day poles overwhelmingly descend from medieval poles <br />This is the same for virtually every country in Europe . The fact that they absorbed colonists doesn’t change that. <br />To suggest otherwise no is frankly bizarre and seems agenda – driven”<br /><br />Yes, I don’t understand what is going on here. Scientists in Poland discovered that some alleles present in EastPolehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02385485387444006342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-3225266835212549142019-06-15T15:09:33.442-07:002019-06-15T15:09:33.442-07:00Modern day poles overwhelmingly descend from medie...Modern day poles overwhelmingly descend from medieval poles <br />This is the same for virtually every country in Europe . The fact that they absorbed colonists doesn’t change that. <br />To suggest otherwise no is frankly bizarre and seems agenda - driven Dragohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06137547950290035805noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-86789043368798526792019-06-15T15:03:36.836-07:002019-06-15T15:03:36.836-07:00@Open Genomes
“You mean that the Scots, Armenians...@Open Genomes<br /><br />“You mean that the Scots, Armenians, ethnic Germans, and Jews never admixed with the ethnic Poles over the centuries? "<br /><br />Because of religious, linguistic and cultural barriers the admixture rate were very low. Poland was not a melting pot.<br />Germans in Poland lived in German villages preserving their language and religion, in 1939 they supported Hitler EastPolehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02385485387444006342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-84528643905768451772019-06-15T13:36:41.629-07:002019-06-15T13:36:41.629-07:00@East Pole
You mean that the Scots, Armenians, et...@East Pole<br /><br />You mean that the Scots, Armenians, ethnic Germans, and Jews never admixed with the ethnic Poles over the centuries? <br /><br />I've seen that a certain (nameless) ethnic Pole here shares a segment with an Ashkenazi Jew on 23andMe. The admixture can and did go in <i>both</i> directions, and you can see it in the above nMonte. There were certainly plenty of Polish Jews Open Genomeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207443325849433636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-42600344702928186722019-06-15T13:04:34.474-07:002019-06-15T13:04:34.474-07:00Otzi the Tyrolean Iceman might've looked like ...Otzi the Tyrolean Iceman might've looked like this:<br /><br />https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/NINTCHDBPICT000216565731.jpg?strip=all&w=767Andrzejewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16348054679275572956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-34549482466232289722019-06-15T06:15:05.153-07:002019-06-15T06:15:05.153-07:00"Researchers are also trying to assess the le..."Researchers are also trying to assess the level of diversity of the population living in the territory of present-day Poland during that period and whether migrants from other areas of Europe, for example from Scandinavia, appeared here. "There is the topic of participation of Scandinavian groups in the creation of the Polish State. Such groups indeed penetrated Poland, they could be ahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00239954589937094679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19788905939526882462019-06-14T22:42:45.445-07:002019-06-14T22:42:45.445-07:00Continuity?
The landscape of the Kujawsko-Pomorsk...Continuity?<br /><br />The landscape of the Kujawsko-Pomorskie Province has also had a twofold influence and owes its form to the particular role of two religious orders. The first are the Teutonic Knights and the second the Mennonites, mysterious and industrious emigrants from the Netherlands who were a characteristic group of Anabaptists. They came to Poland to escape the anti- reformation and weurehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18217998844540373877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-5901050260387649402019-06-14T22:30:06.422-07:002019-06-14T22:30:06.422-07:00Otherwise it’s easy to see continuity if you would...Otherwise it’s easy to see continuity if you would the neglect the Jewish or Mennonites influences.....If this is still possible or may be these influences are watered down. Or indeed like open genomes says murdered by the Nazis.weurehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18217998844540373877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-90451039768974528092019-06-14T17:49:28.880-07:002019-06-14T17:49:28.880-07:00@Davidski @Open Genome
"You should be more w...@Davidski @Open Genome<br /><br />"You should be more worried about the nonsense that Joe Flood is peddling in a new "preprint" that he's putting together about R1a.<br /><br />https://www.academia.edu/39342899/EXPLOSION_FROM_THE_STEPPE_The_distribution_and_origins_of_the_Y-haplogroup_R1a?fbclid=IwAR2HxlKvZMewuLULW_Xb5V1n3r4AcEuXVAwapkKhR2Rm5jaZZYXutS3pQuc<br /><br />He's Andrzejewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16348054679275572956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-73922052046973330322019-06-14T16:28:42.554-07:002019-06-14T16:28:42.554-07:00@Open Genomes
You should be more worried about th...@Open Genomes<br /><br />You should be more worried about the nonsense that Joe Flood is peddling in a new "preprint" that he's putting together about R1a.<br /><br />https://www.academia.edu/39342899/EXPLOSION_FROM_THE_STEPPE_The_distribution_and_origins_of_the_Y-haplogroup_R1a?fbclid=IwAR2HxlKvZMewuLULW_Xb5V1n3r4AcEuXVAwapkKhR2Rm5jaZZYXutS3pQuc<br /><br />He's claiming (or at Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-14920321570004103512019-06-14T16:15:09.325-07:002019-06-14T16:15:09.325-07:00So I tried modeling the ancestry of Anatolia_Barci...So I tried modeling the ancestry of Anatolia_Barcin_N with the Global25/nMonte using a whole bunch of samples, including the new Epipaleolithic forager from Pinarbasi. And yep, nMonte always picks this sample as the main source of ancestry for Anatolia_Barcin_N. However, judging by the statistical fits, it looks like we don't yet have the right separate proxies for the eastern and southern Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-34629946027736164342019-06-14T14:54:39.525-07:002019-06-14T14:54:39.525-07:00@Open Genomes
You are confusing things. Poles can ...@Open Genomes<br />You are confusing things. Poles can have many meaning. Ethnic Poles means Slavic autochthons of Poland. Poles as citizens of Poland includes everybody who is living there and has citizenship. They can be ethnically Jewish, German, Armenian etc.<br />In genetics by Poles we mean ethnic Poles, not citizens of Poland.<br />EastPolehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02385485387444006342noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-32044458714038617162019-06-14T13:29:09.544-07:002019-06-14T13:29:09.544-07:00Here's then nMonte for a Pole born in 1917 in ...Here's then nMonte for a Pole born in 1917 in Lublin. Notice the Sintashta and the Beaker_Poland percentages:<br /><br />We can say that he has continuity from the Early Bronze Age Beakers of Poland right down to early 20th century Lublin:<br /><br /><a href="http://open-genomes.org/analysis/PCA/nMonte/getNmonte.html?id=OG3-penalty-0-limit-0.4-exclude-Modern" rel="nofollow">Ancestry Open Genomeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207443325849433636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-53901663267940047862019-06-14T13:18:45.914-07:002019-06-14T13:18:45.914-07:00It's a truism that (indigenous) people almost ...It's a truism that (indigenous) people <b><i>almost anywhere</i></b> have <i>some</i> ancestry from the Mesolithic and Neolithic. Mesolithic EHGs and WHGs don't exist <i>anywhere</i> in their unadmixed form, and their ancestry only forms a small percentage of any population today. If you want to find the descendants of the Early European Farmers, look to Sardinia, not Poland.<br /><br /><Open Genomeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207443325849433636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-22609354690452676932019-06-14T13:13:26.691-07:002019-06-14T13:13:26.691-07:00@Simon W ‘And among the tall types there are both ...@Simon W ‘And among the tall types there are both ones with broad shaped face (euryprosopic) and ones with long shaped face (leptoprosopic). The Cromagnoid types (Dalonordic or Dalofaelid or Phalian) indeed don't have very short faces, because they are tall people, but they do have very broad faces, hence they are not leptoprosopic, they are euryprosopic, i.e. broad faced.’<br /><br />Let’s weurehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18217998844540373877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-73779641506098542142019-06-14T10:08:43.636-07:002019-06-14T10:08:43.636-07:00@Simon_W "But when the typologists speak abou...@Simon_W "But when the typologists speak about facial shape they usually mean the proportions between the height of the face and its breadth. Hence longer faced for the typologist doesn't necessarily mean particularly long in absolute terms. The short gracile Mediterranean type doesn't have a very long face, but its proportions are definitely elongated because it's narrow in Andrzejewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16348054679275572956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-21433176463418276982019-06-14T10:05:56.510-07:002019-06-14T10:05:56.510-07:00@Simon, yes, as people become taller "the pro...@Simon, yes, as people become taller "the proportions between the height of the face and its breadth" change, is what I am saying. Not that taller people simply have absolutely longer faces in same proportion as shorter folk because they are larger in general. A taller person with the same facial proportions as a shorter person likely genetic makeup for a relatively broader face, offsetMatthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-41742404631888957312019-06-14T10:03:48.641-07:002019-06-14T10:03:48.641-07:00EEF had short faces in absolute terms, but at the ...EEF had short faces in absolute terms, but at the same time much more narrow than the WHG, hence quite leptoprosopic. Corded people had very long and very narrow faces, hence leptoprosopic. Yamnaya had quite broad faces in absolute terms, but overall mesoprosopic, i.e. intermediate in shape. And there is no necessary Connection between facial shape and cranial index either. Ötzi may look broad Simon_Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04454497745874406294noreply@blogger.com