tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post4775079524204824030..comments2024-03-28T17:16:03.042-07:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: Exotic female migrants in Early Medieval Bavaria (Veeramah et al. 2018)Davidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger49125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-83958161466780254802018-04-15T23:55:31.292-07:002018-04-15T23:55:31.292-07:00@Open Genomes
The Iberomaurusian thread is here.....@Open Genomes<br /><br />The Iberomaurusian thread is here...<br /><br />http://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2018/03/the-iberomaurusians.html<br /><br />By the way, what are the most reliable Y-haplogroup calls for the 55 Eurasian samples, and is there any way to work out which periods they're from?Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-60971804493107875152018-04-15T23:48:25.077-07:002018-04-15T23:48:25.077-07:00The Eurasian Steppe Ys are here!
55 Eurasian Step...The Eurasian Steppe Ys are here!<br /><br /><a href="https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Rja6ZyjQrz3UK7_HTagkzczoOFjwcXOGdNOm9FC3Rik/edit?usp=sharing" rel="nofollow">55 Eurasian Steppe selected Y haplogroups</a><br /><br />Also, everyone can get <i>all</i> the named Y SNPs for the 95 males, positive and negative, from these .tsv files right here, and import them into any spreadsheet:<br /><a Open Genomeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207443325849433636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-55773209734846673982018-03-16T08:58:03.248-07:002018-03-16T08:58:03.248-07:00David, I think the new van de Loosdrecht et al. (2...David, I think the new van de Loosdrecht et al. (2008) Ibero-Maurasian aDNA study is worth a separate post on its own. The Europe Neolithic certainly has a kind of "Natufian" component (i.e. Stuttgart LBK), and this kind of North African "Ibero-Maurasian" component may well turn up in Mesolithic or Early Neolithic Iberia. <br /><br />Do we see any sign of it now in the Early Open Genomeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207443325849433636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-48782183833762949612018-03-15T15:42:56.090-07:002018-03-15T15:42:56.090-07:00@All
Please note that I've just renamed the G...@All<br /><br />Please note that I've just renamed the Gepid and Ostrogothic samples in all datasheets and graphics to the following...<br /><br />Gepid_Serbia_ACD:VIM_2<br /><br />Ostrogothic_Crimea_ACD:KER_1Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-8622137269312878092018-03-15T04:35:02.746-07:002018-03-15T04:35:02.746-07:00@Anthro
"Roman age flow into Balkan province...@Anthro<br /><br />"Roman age flow into Balkan provinces north of Thessaly would have been almost exclusively comprised of Greek speakers from Anatolia. Not sure about Peloponnese or Greece, though, since it had good maritime access."<br /><br />I agree with that, further Near Eastern influx into the Balkans (and I do think there might have been some compared to even the ancient higher Alogohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12311735856824330486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-36185145987971379492018-03-14T21:37:42.769-07:002018-03-14T21:37:42.769-07:00@Alogo
Well, it's true that southern Italy wa...@Alogo<br /><br />Well, it's true that southern Italy was more cosmopolitan than Moesia/Illyricum/Macedonia and better positioned travel-wise to receive Levantine input. This is especially so for Campania, Calabria and Puglia. Thus, more Levantine affinity would make sense. <br /><br />Roman age flow into Balkan provinces north of Thessaly would have been almost exclusively comprised of GreekAnthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-30052178047346101512018-03-14T12:32:01.631-07:002018-03-14T12:32:01.631-07:00@Anthro
Both (if anything the ancient Balkan samp...@Anthro<br /><br />Both (if anything the ancient Balkan samples had less of it compared to at least some areas like the Aegean or deep southern Greece). And I don't think the Caucasus/Levant ratio in Anatolia_BA can wholly explain what we see in Italy, at least south of Tuscany. You likely need Levant/North African type of stuff.<br /><br />I've played with ancient and modern Balkan Alogohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12311735856824330486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19356333846186736482018-03-14T12:14:32.480-07:002018-03-14T12:14:32.480-07:00@Alogo
Than contemporary Balkaners or ancient Bal...@Alogo<br /><br />Than contemporary Balkaners or ancient Balkan samples? The former have a considerable "trans-Danubian" superstrate(mostly Slavic) upwards of 30-60%. Their reduced Anatolia_BA fraction may correspond to reduced Levant affinity relative to Abruzzo. Anthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-26212149120047786662018-03-14T04:18:24.630-07:002018-03-14T04:18:24.630-07:00Anthro said: "Oh, take note of Italian_Abruzz...Anthro said: "Oh, take note of Italian_Abruzzo! Haven't tested my theory of it being Levant-poor(relative to Italy_South) yet, but it's not a bad input pop for Balkaners like I previously surmised."<br /><br />It does seem to have lower Levant-like stuff compared to Italy_South (=Calabria?) but still higher than the Balkans.Alogohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12311735856824330486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-81203050962458371372018-03-13T11:41:22.455-07:002018-03-13T11:41:22.455-07:00@Davidski; True, I'd thought these were late S...@Davidski; True, I'd thought these were late Sarmatians from a similar period to the other samples, but they're just from the same era as Unterlander's paper (much less interesting... which feels odd to say, but is true).Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-23891010914358043262018-03-13T09:42:04.342-07:002018-03-13T09:42:04.342-07:00Hunnic elite were Turkic but lingua franca is unkn...Hunnic elite were Turkic but lingua franca is unknown.Cpkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10415788952914698806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-89413694263388705552018-03-13T08:25:48.558-07:002018-03-13T08:25:48.558-07:00This paper doesn't seem to mention it, but the...This paper doesn't seem to mention it, but the Thuringii also are reported to have (Hunnic?) females with elongated skulls, and also, at times, alliances with the Huns.Dave the Slothtopushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01636798760680009469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-8459399048672412322018-03-13T08:08:43.975-07:002018-03-13T08:08:43.975-07:00My close cousin (23andMe) who shares my maternal g...My close cousin (23andMe) who shares my maternal grandfather's English surname is 1/2 English , 1/2 German (Thuringian). She has mtDNA D4j and still 0.1 East Asian ancestry. Now I know why.AWoodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14966600445259901063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-6804775398160278002018-03-13T04:41:02.013-07:002018-03-13T04:41:02.013-07:00@Matt
The Sarmatians from this paper don't ha...@Matt<br /><br />The Sarmatians from this paper don't have enough markers to bother with. But they're Sarmatians from Pokrovka.<br /><br />And there already are Sarmatians from Pokrovka in the Global25 datasheets.Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-29965631755111703242018-03-13T03:13:36.217-07:002018-03-13T03:13:36.217-07:00@aniasi
"I remember reading that the main la...@aniasi<br /><br />"<i>I remember reading that the main language of the Huns was actually Gothic, which seems to have been spoken by all their tribal groups.</i>"<br /><br />According to Priscus, who had diner with Attila, both Hunnic and Gothic were the lingua franca at Attila's court:<br /><br />"<i> As I waited and walked up and down in front of the enclosure which Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-13873559982871070952018-03-13T02:56:31.469-07:002018-03-13T02:56:31.469-07:00Hmm.
Germany_Medieval:AED_249
England_...Hmm.<br /><br /> Germany_Medieval:AED_249 <br /> England_Roman:6DT3 65%<br /> Baltic_BA:Kivutkalns215 15.4%<br /> England_Roman:6DT21 11.2%<br /> England_Roman:6DT23 8.4%<br /> Distance 2.7803%<br /><br /> Germany_Medieval:AED_106 <br /> Beaker_Britain:I2568 36.4%<br /> Poland_BA:I6531 21%<br /> CWC_Baltic:RISE00 20.6%<br /> Beaker_Iberia:I6472 13.2%<br /> Baltic_BA:Kivutkalns209Arzahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10459843383682766479noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-1605331077536145232018-03-13T02:43:00.804-07:002018-03-13T02:43:00.804-07:00@Simon_W
Haha, was going to say that you'd be...@Simon_W<br /><br />Haha, was going to say that you'd be pleased with this paper as it seems to provide an elegant, if unexpected, explanation for your findings. It also explains the "Balkanic traits" in Bavarians that phenoforums people discuss non-stop. <br /><br />I'd be curious to see new results for her using either the German outlier300 or sample 535(both being SE shifted)Anthro Surveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07686104871694563174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-63428602558552224122018-03-13T02:05:48.218-07:002018-03-13T02:05:48.218-07:00@aniasi
"With all of the migrations, regroup...@aniasi<br /><br />"<i>With all of the migrations, regroupings, and assimilation, it wouldn't surprise me that some Hunnic, Avar, or other Easter-Nomad women were taken as brides, especially if their husbands wanted to claim some of their heritage.</i>"<br /><br />Who knows. Maybe heritage was a secondary reason the Germanic tribes refused to live under Attila's sons as vassals.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-55944805104708395682018-03-13T01:48:21.885-07:002018-03-13T01:48:21.885-07:00These samples are probably a lot like GAC anyways....<i>These samples are probably a lot like GAC anyways.</i><br /><br />Hopefully not all of them:<br />PL_N19 Funnel Beaker Culture female 3628BC-3589BC<br />PL_N20 Funnel Beaker Culture male 3626BC-3591BC<br />PL_N17 Early Bronze Age male 1953BC-1880BC<br />PL_N18 Funnel Beaker Culture female 3626BC-3591BC<br />PL_N22 Brzesc Kujawski Group of the Lengyel Culture female 4355BC-4266BC<br /Arzahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10459843383682766479noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-57601723444640926312018-03-13T01:45:33.095-07:002018-03-13T01:45:33.095-07:00@Matt
Hunnish admixture in Gepids totally makes s...@Matt<br /><br />Hunnish admixture in Gepids totally makes sense, historically speaking. Ardaric was one of Attila's most trusted generals, together with Valamir. So you can bet the alliance between Gepids and Huns was cemented with marriages.<br /><br />https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ArdaricAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19627538915767593402018-03-13T01:45:05.626-07:002018-03-13T01:45:05.626-07:00Though looking at some more dimensions, Crimean Go...Though looking at some more dimensions, Crimean Goth probably needs some modern Iranian like and East Asian as well, as the CHG affinity relative to Iran_N+East Asia looks too weak to fit with a purely South Caucasian+Germanic mix.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-51860280697714598612018-03-13T01:44:59.721-07:002018-03-13T01:44:59.721-07:00Speaking in terms of everyday culture, narratives ...Speaking in terms of everyday culture, narratives of Attila's Huns are more or less still omnipresent in German culture. As someone who is partly Bavarian, I would say some Bavarians would be flattered to have one of Attila’s Huns in there lineage.Katharóshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16649693310029639154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-36258917650693162582018-03-13T01:36:33.695-07:002018-03-13T01:36:33.695-07:00Quick work!
Using G25 to try and get a basic hand...Quick work!<br /><br />Using G25 to try and get a basic handle on where these samples fit:<br /><br />First, NJ Trees with population averages: <br /><br />All Averages: https://imgur.com/a/td2NG<br />Broad West Eurasian Averages: https://imgur.com/a/FTCZJ<br /><br />Then, reprocessing Samples through PCA, on the restricted Broad West Eurasian Averages panel : https://imgur.com/a/89uyw (I've Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-40911369853715734592018-03-13T00:58:54.133-07:002018-03-13T00:58:54.133-07:00But these results are interesting, they make sense...But these results are interesting, they make sense of the strong Southeast European and slight East Asian admixture in my 3/4 Swabian 1/4 Swiss grandmother.Simon_Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04454497745874406294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-32922554844344560732018-03-13T00:55:41.131-07:002018-03-13T00:55:41.131-07:00And the Roman soldier from 300 AD could be anythin...And the Roman soldier from 300 AD could be anything, because from 212 AD onwards practically all free inhabitants of the Roman Empire had the Roman citizenship. <br />https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutio_Antoniniana<br /><br />So no way can we say he must be typical for Iron Age central Italians, let alone Latins.Simon_Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04454497745874406294noreply@blogger.com