tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post6405153974547123279..comments2024-03-19T02:38:12.460-07:00Comments on Eurogenes Blog: Big deal of 2018: Yamnaya not related to MaykopDavidskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comBlogger70125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-1647659143231787092019-03-13T13:22:08.834-07:002019-03-13T13:22:08.834-07:00That Hajji Firuz R1b sample is from the Iron Age. ...That Hajji Firuz R1b sample is from the Iron Age. You'll see when the paper comes out.<br /><br />Meantime, enjoy this...<br /><br /><a href="https://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2018/06/yamnaya-isnt-from-iran-just-like-r1a.html" rel="nofollow">Yamnaya isn't from Iran just like R1a isn't from India</a><br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-49135422854543258462019-03-13T07:04:57.124-07:002019-03-13T07:04:57.124-07:00Wang does everything to support an Iranian homelan...Wang does everything to support an Iranian homeland for PIEbiaystiorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05157451250973378990noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-53361700031495872842018-11-11T13:34:15.728-08:002018-11-11T13:34:15.728-08:00@blogmaster
Obviously you're not very good at...@blogmaster<br /><br />Obviously you're not very good at this.<br /><br />The green component is very old and doesn't come from the same source in Yamnaya and Maykop.<br /><br />It was already on the steppe during the Mesolithic when Maykop or Iranian farmers didn't yet exist.<br /><br /><a href="https://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2018/07/ahead-of-pack.html" rel="nofollow">Ahead of the Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-19878215729491474222018-11-11T12:50:23.717-08:002018-11-11T12:50:23.717-08:00You are trying to say Yamnaya are not related to A...You are trying to say Yamnaya are not related to Anatolian Neolithics. It doesn't matter to what drives you, because obviously Iranian (green is related to both Maykop and Yamnaya)blogmasterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11834163614642737338noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-56083141865408552792018-11-07T20:30:35.143-08:002018-11-07T20:30:35.143-08:00Interestingly, the one D-stat/f4-stat that remains...Interestingly, the one D-stat/f4-stat that remains significant when I strip things down to transversion sites, is this one...<br /><br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA AG3-MA1 Mbuti -0.0154 -2.997 162802<br /><br />I mean, unless you're obsessive compulsive then that's close enough to sigma 3.<br /><br />This stat isn't driven by any sort of CHG-related input into Hittite era Anatolia. Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-61914669265747447582018-11-07T15:43:24.654-08:002018-11-07T15:43:24.654-08:00@Matt
I'm still checking things out, but here...@Matt<br /><br />I'm still checking things out, but here are some extra stats...<br /><br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Han Mbuti -0.000857 -3.728 933179<br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Karitiana Mbuti -0.000902 -3.34 933178<br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Onge Mbuti -0.000663 -2.293 971355<br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Papuan Mbuti -0.000613 -2.267 933178<br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-70685440948663990972018-11-07T15:24:01.339-08:002018-11-07T15:24:01.339-08:00I'm a bit uncertain on all this stuff with Ana...I'm a bit uncertain on all this stuff with Anatolian shifts, and what to make of some of those patterns (EHG+Yamnaya+ANE ish pattern but also Minoan, Levant_Chl, Parkhai_Eneolithic), but baseline questions: <br /><br />1) Any stats go positive? All these tables are negative. <br />2) What do the ENA / Native American outgroups and Ust Ishim do with this data? Close to neutral or any unusual Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-90750344062739003532018-11-07T15:18:00.784-08:002018-11-07T15:18:00.784-08:00@epoch
Removing MA2203 actually helps things a li...@epoch<br /><br />Removing MA2203 actually helps things a little, although not significantly, but maybe that's because this sample has more heterogeneous ancestry, with both more basal and more steppe.<br /><br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Okunevo Mbuti -0.001056 -4.326<br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA EHG Mbuti -0.001219 -4.229<br />Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA Minoan Mbuti -0.001126 -4.251<br Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-25543638176718932522018-11-07T13:38:54.027-08:002018-11-07T13:38:54.027-08:00@All
A couple of interesting tables...
Anatolia_...@All<br /><br />A couple of interesting tables...<br /><br /><a href="https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IIAHc6Dc5zQ/W-Im5aV28bI/AAAAAAAAHTk/j1N78PHnqJ0zrkjkIrcIkGvxfUkcdcC6wCLcBGAs/s1600/Anatolia_EBA_vs_MLBA_f4_Chimp.png" rel="nofollow">Anatolia_EBA vs MLBA f4/Chimp</a><br /><br /><a href="https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-BL7sC9fIQ5c/W-IpGimXFHI/AAAAAAAAHTw/BSODWzFZ1RQtYowh3dToFmu4W6hRaNaXQCLcBGAs/s1600/Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-87674001237092173152018-11-07T13:31:26.097-08:002018-11-07T13:31:26.097-08:00@David
Removing MA2203 from that list, does that ...@David<br /><br />Removing MA2203 from that list, does that change much?epochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08369114970416550997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-8499211838682328692018-11-07T12:42:38.588-08:002018-11-07T12:42:38.588-08:00@epoch
They're samples from Central Anatolia ...@epoch<br /><br />They're samples from Central Anatolia from the Damgaard et al. paper.<br /><br />Anatolia_EBA:MA2210<br />Anatolia_EBA:MA2212<br />Anatolia_EBA:MA2213<br /><br />Anatolia_MLBA:MA2200<br />Anatolia_MLBA:MA2203<br />Anatolia_MLBA:MA2205<br />Anatolia_MLBA:MA2206<br />Anatolia_MLBA:MA2208<br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-28998548130563738002018-11-07T12:25:38.371-08:002018-11-07T12:25:38.371-08:00@David
Of what samples exactly are those Anatoli...@David <br /><br />Of what samples exactly are those Anatolia_EBA and Anatolia_MLBA composed? epochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08369114970416550997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-48750004503132273022018-11-06T11:38:03.270-08:002018-11-06T11:38:03.270-08:00@Synome
Heh, using the full genome Mbuti sequence...@Synome<br /><br />Heh, using the full genome Mbuti sequences actually seems to be increasing the Z scores.<br /><br />Hang on, I'm going to do this properly, and copy a format from one of the Harvard papers that used f4 stats to look at population shifts in ancient Europe.<br /><br />I'll post the results in a new post.<br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-70015562476558365022018-11-06T06:01:02.168-08:002018-11-06T06:01:02.168-08:00@ Davidski
Out of curiosity, how much does using ...@ Davidski<br /><br />Out of curiosity, how much does using Mbuti outgroup change things?Synomehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02168979109558144980noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-62916815247265838322018-11-06T02:21:03.702-08:002018-11-06T02:21:03.702-08:00@All
Badabing Badaboom!
Chimp EHG Anatolia_EBA A...@All<br /><br />Badabing Badaboom!<br /><br />Chimp EHG Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA 0.00095 3.236 1052793<br />Chimp Minoan Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA 0.000913 3.066 940380<br />Chimp Sintashta_MLBA_o3 Anatolia_EBA Anatolia_MLBA 0.00113 3.065 717483<br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-76702871920388041412018-11-05T20:42:49.443-08:002018-11-05T20:42:49.443-08:00Predictions. There's two strains of Greeks. Ea...Predictions. There's two strains of Greeks. Each strain formed in the Iron age. <br /><br />Aegean Greeks are half Balkan IE (Greek. Mostly EEF, some CHG, signifcant Steppe) and half East Med (Anatolia EBA & Levant BA combo). Mainland Greeks are mostly Balkan IE with significant Slavic admixture. <br /><br />Samuel Andrewshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09054267559597526866noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-15776420697858317712018-11-05T20:24:56.300-08:002018-11-05T20:24:56.300-08:00@Palacista
Am I missing something? Why would Mayk...@Palacista<br /><br /><i>Am I missing something? Why would Maykop being unrelated to Yamnaya be news?</i><br /><br />Because in recent years it was widely but wrongly assumed that the spread of CHG/Iran_N ancestry into the steppes was due to Eneolithic/Bronze Age population movements from the southern Caucasus and Iran, and that Maykop was involved in this process.<br /><br />In fact, I'd sayDavidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-85827928757458830872018-11-05T18:30:39.869-08:002018-11-05T18:30:39.869-08:00@PF
Davidski, why is basically the same EHG D-sta...@PF<br /><br /><i>Davidski, why is basically the same EHG D-stat totally different in Damgaard et al? Are you using just the sample that seems like it has the most steppe?</i><br /><br />I'm using all of the available Anatolia_MLBA samples and all of the available EHG samples, and Chimp as the outgroup, which I find produces more robust results with ancient DNA than Mbuti. <br /><br />Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-82190659464102567292018-11-05T17:49:14.292-08:002018-11-05T17:49:14.292-08:00@Arch Hades
Doesnt look like Yamnaya is derived f...@Arch Hades<br /><br /><i>Doesnt look like Yamnaya is derived from Maykop, or the Vice Versa. BUT, it looks to me they both derive significantly from a common source. The dark green component in the ADMIXTURE run is huge in both of them.</i><br /><br />From my blog post...<br /><br /><b>To be sure, Yamnaya does show a close genome-wide genetic relationship with an earlier group from the North Davidskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04637918905430604850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-82133741279080019642018-11-05T13:54:10.278-08:002018-11-05T13:54:10.278-08:00All, Jeong's Eastern steppe paper is done: htt...All, Jeong's Eastern steppe paper is done: https://phys.org/news/2018-11-oldest-evidence-dairying-east-asian.html<br /><br />http://www.pnas.org/cgi/doi/10.1073/pnas.1813608115Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04517454865405705885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-85400493117399626022018-11-05T09:31:01.040-08:002018-11-05T09:31:01.040-08:00Am I missing something? Why would Maykop being unr...Am I missing something? Why would Maykop being unrelated to Yamnaya be news? Palacistahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00914286363588675042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-28638851194462447842018-11-05T09:22:28.086-08:002018-11-05T09:22:28.086-08:00Davidski, why is basically the same EHG D-stat tot...Davidski, why is basically the same EHG D-stat totally different in Damgaard et al? Are you using just the sample that seems like it has the most steppe?<br /><br />Chad's qpAdm runs make sense and are more consistent with published work and what people (including me) have seen with G25/nMonte. <br /><br />Anyways, let's assume there's more steppe in Anatolia_MLBA than EBA. I don'PFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13780789381709373839noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-69357004275995576482018-11-05T08:32:10.380-08:002018-11-05T08:32:10.380-08:00Doesnt look like Yamnaya is derived from Maykop, o...Doesnt look like Yamnaya is derived from Maykop, or the Vice Versa. BUT, it looks to me they both derive significantly from a common source. The dark green component in the ADMIXTURE run is huge in both of them.Arch Hadeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00679577049261430513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-48895763986312699562018-11-05T06:15:40.745-08:002018-11-05T06:15:40.745-08:00This doesn't seem logical to me. If these peop...This doesn't seem logical to me. If these people have Anatolian names and are not Indo-Europeans, who are they?Cpkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10415788952914698806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4123559132014627431.post-71686052750774732602018-11-04T22:01:48.438-08:002018-11-04T22:01:48.438-08:00I've always been a little skeptical of the Hit...I've always been a little skeptical of the Hittites-through-the Balkans idea, seemed kind of ad-hoc, but Davidski's case is looking more and more convincing. I don't mean to step on Grey's toes here, but if I can speculate idly here for a moment, it makes one wonder about that double-headed eagle symbolism that's common to both the Hittites and the Illyrians. Yeah, it's Bob Floyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01863468406651284016noreply@blogger.com