A new dataset has appeared online from a yet to be published paper titled
Cosmopolitanism in the depths of Barbaricum evidenced by archaeogenomic data from the Late Iron Age Goth community of the Masłomęcz group [Update: the paper is now available at this
Link].
Most of these Gothic samples are clearly of Scandinavian origin, and very similar to present-day Swedes. Overall, however, they create a somewhat heterogeneous cluster that also overlaps with present-day Poles thanks to the presence of a few Balto-Slavic-related and possibly Roman-related individuals.
The Principal Component Analysis (PCA) plots below were produced with the excellent
Vahaduo G25 Global Views tool using the data
here.
Their Y-haplogroups more or less reflect the PCA results:
PL046 R-YP6228
PL048 I-PH833
PL049 I-A11537
PL052 R-Y48961
PL059 I-PH833
PL062 I-S15301
PL065 I-Y294193
PL066 R-FGC2555
PL067 R-S7759
PL070 I-CTS10028
PL071 I-BY316
PL076 I-S9318
PL082 I-Z2041
PL085 J-Z38241
PL086 I-FT29339
See also...
Early Slavs from Tribal Period Poland
Wielbark Goths were overwhelmingly of Scandinavian origin
High-resolution stuff
1,213 comments:
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bzrSF5LOI9ekFZKiTn8JH-eKfKH1ltPa/view?usp=sharing
Looking at the division of the IBD segments of medieval Poles, it is probably time to reject the idea of an early medieval exchange of the Polish population:
https://polandmaibd.netlify.app/
@ambron
Interesting maps, but they don't show what you're claiming.
The Medieval Polish samples only share significant IBD with each other. They also share some IBD with preceding populations, suggesting that they have ancestry from Wielbark Goths and so on, which is something we already knew.
In regard to the Polish Corded Ware samples sharing IBD across much of Eurasia, again this is expected, because Corded Ware and their immediate descendants ranged all the way from Western Europe to Mongolia and India.
Also, Yamnaya and Afanasievo share a lot of IBD with Corded Ware, so their descendants can look like they're closely related to Corded Ware.
Thank you, Davidski, for converting these files; they are very useful to me.
@Mr Shomu Tepe
Would you or crashdoc be able to get the coverage for the samples David just converted to G25 for you, so I can integrate them into the comprehensive list of G25 ancients listed here:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/0q39lrsynq7prjc7mm8gq/G25-Ancients.txt?rlkey=33i5tycf3nd6glv1w7z6dleco&e=4&dl=0
While we may already have samples of these individuals, I usually cross reference them to make sure we have the highest quality versions at all times.
While I could simply copy the coverage listed in the AADR this won't be exact as the way people process samples often differs (usually only slightly, but I prefer to have the most accurate information).
A perfect metaphor of the origin and destiny of Y hg. R1b1:
"Despite their similar orthography and meaning, "isle" and "island" are completely unrelated. The word "island" was inherited from Proto-Germanic *awjōlandą, itself from *awjō, (island), and *landą (land), while "isle" was borrowed from Old French "isle" (cf Modern French "île"), itself from Latin "insula". While the Germanic word was still spelled "iland" in Middle English, an -s- was inserted around the 16th century due to a false association with "isle".
Additional remarks:
-Dutch also inherited "eiland" from *awjōlandą, but didn't alter its orthography.
-In common usage, German replaced its inherited word "Eiland" with the Latin loanword "Insel", from the same source as "isle".
-The first element of *awjōlandą, *awjō, also yielded Danish "ø", Swedish "ö", Norwegian "øy" and Icelandic "ey".
-The Germanic root *awjō is ultimately related to Latin "aqua" through Indo-European."
And also in French "aqua" souds similar as to Germanic languages,
@MiroCyo
😀I simply inserted these updated coordinates into the existing ones from the G25 Ajeje Brazorf list; since I don't know about the coverage, I removed that parameter from the sample index.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ROZtd8QA5li6a0H7zpwmITehDTHXbWkn/view?usp=drivesdk
let me know if the link doesn't open.
David
If medieval Poles share the most common ancestors amongst themselves, and secondly with all medieval Slavs (Czech, Slovak, Pannonian, Croatian, Ukrainian and Russian), this implies that the Slavic migration did not come to Poland, but originated from Poland. If a mass migration from the east had arrived in Poland in the early Middle Ages, medieval Poles would share more common ancestors with medieval Ukrainians and Russians than they do amongst themselves, just as Germans do with Poles in the studies by Ralph and Coop.
As for CWC, the most important point is that medieval Poles share IBD with the Polish CWC, which indicates the biological continuity of the Polish population since the late Neolithic.
@ambron
It's obvious on that map that the immediate ancestors of the Medieval Poles and other early Slavs have not been sampled, in Poland or elsewhere.
During the 551BC-52BC and 51BC-449AD timeframes there's no population that can be reasonably said to be proto-Slavic based on the IBD results.
There is some noticeable IBD sharing with the Germanic populations of Poland, like in southeastern Poland, and also in Slovakia and Serbia, but these hits can be explained by foreign admixture and outliers that we see in the Medieval Polish sample set.
The 450AD - 949AD timeframe in largely during and after the main Slavic expansion, so there's no way to tell from that where the Slavic homeland was. But interestingly, Poland is poorly represented at this critical time.
@Davidski
Hi, i created a program to make heatmaps based on g25 distances.
https://genarchivist.net/showthread.php?tid=2589
While I was looking for g25 averages to use as a reference, I came across this old dataset derived from the eurogenes k13 calculator: https://binshare.net/aBOIBs3oUblNb2mwJIFs
This means that someone at the time had access to their genetic data.
There are very detailed regions for which it would be wonderful to have g25 coordinates. Unfortunately, there is no trace of this in the g25 dataset.
Would you be able to recover some of them by any chance?
Also having PLINK and Eigenstrat dataset would be great.
It's a shame, with all the new ancient specimens we have publicly available today, that the modern ones are less than ten years ago.
Thank you.
David
"But interestingly, Poland is poorly represented at this critical time."
In Poland, this was still the cremation period, so samples are scarce. However, as I said, if there had been a mass migration from the east to Poland at that time, medieval Poles would have shared more IBD with medieval Ukrainians and Russians than with each other.
@ambron
There are hardly any medieval samples from Ukraine there, and we know that those that we have are irrelevant even based on basic genetic structure.
So clearly something is missing, but there's no evidence on that map that this something was located in Poland.
@Stefano
Those modern samples in the K13 and K36 are people who donated their results (not data) to the datasheets.
There's no way to get most of these people into the G25 without getting in touch with them personally and asking for their raw data files.
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